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Messages - beedawg

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31
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 12, 2012, 08:17:31 AM »
There is also some learning on how media reports accidents.  The Lacrosse Tribune always reports when a rider is wearing full gear, I have yet to see any Minnesota media provide the same.

What's "full gear"?  Do I need leather pants, or are textile pants OK?  How thick do they have to be?  Do chaps count?  How about denim?  I've seen nearly new rigid Levis give almost no protection in a 5 mph drop.

Is a heavy shirt good enough, or do I need a jacket?  How about a windbreaker?  What if my shoes just barely cover my ankle? 

Rhetorical questions, but I'm trying to make the point that "full gear" is vague.  All it really means to me is that the person probably wasn't in shorts, t-shirt, and flip-flops, and wearing a baseball cap backwards.

32
General Banter / Re: Helmet Laws
« on: June 12, 2012, 07:51:38 AM »
What metrics exist for having a helmet law in MN?

I'm not sure what you're asking, Tim.  Are you asking what evidence there is that a helmet law is ineffective in saving lives, reducing injuries, or having any other "good" effects?

How about a graduated license system like they have in the UK?

Maybe a slight thread-jack, but an interesting question to me.  I personally think a graduated system is an excellent idea, although I don't support increased legal restrictions on motorcyclists.  Graduated licensing seems to be more effective than training in reducing motorcycle crashes, though.

Brent

33
General Banter / Re: Helmet Laws
« on: June 12, 2012, 06:33:59 AM »
Call me back when we have a solution to the "drain on society" that smoking is and we can talk about putting helmets on a few people that aren't smart enough to do it themselves.

Is the "social cost" of smoking as high as the "social cost" of helmetless riders?  The Time article you referenced makes no claim about the cost of smoking, only the death toll.

The few people I know who've died of smoking-related illnesses went pretty quickly, but I have two friends from childhood who will never live  independently because of traumatic brain injury.

34
General Banter / Re: Helmet Laws
« on: June 11, 2012, 08:32:36 AM »
But saying that, if they did pass a helmet law, i wouldnt really care.

I used to think I wouldn't care, but I have a selfish personal reason to oppose helmet laws.  I think fewer people would ride if Minnesota had a helmet law.  The primary reason some of my students take a BRC is so they can ride without a helmet. 

I agree with Greg that riding with a nice full-face (or modular) helmet is much more comfortable thanr riding without, but not everyone thinks so.  Pat Hahn hoped to demonstrate that if people were given nice helmets, they'd like them and continue to wear them, but his experiment fell short of proving that.  Some people just don't want to wear helmets when they ride.

35
General Banter / Re: Helmet Laws
« on: June 08, 2012, 10:23:58 PM »
My point here is that I shouldn't have to pay to subsidize the insurance rates paid by individuals who are almost twice as likely as I am to suffer a TBI in a single vehicle accident due to a choice they freely make. 

The fact that someone is twice as likely to suffer a TBI in an accident doesn't mean you're subsidizing them.  If you're three times as likely to have that single-vehicle accident in the first place because of how much you ride, where you ride, the way you ride, or any other reason, then they're subsidizing you.

Brent

36
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 08, 2012, 10:11:59 PM »
Does anyone know what a "Yamaha Racer" is?  (Guessing the bike was painted and all decals removed.)

<snippage happened>

    Vehicle 1:
       2012   YAMAHA RACER 

<more snippage>


I wonder if someone told the guy who wrote the report that the bike was a Yamaha Raider and he thought they said Racer.


37
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 08, 2012, 04:30:56 PM »
I doubt if a helmet would help someone RUN OVER by an SUV at highway speed.

Probably right, TK, but we don't know what happened in this crash.  The article in the Strib doesn't say she was RUN OVER by an SUV.  It just says she was "was thrown into the path of a SUV," and I don't know what that means.  I know I can fit underneath pretty much any SUV, and with just a little luck someone could drive an SUV over me (i.e., RUN OVER me) at highway speed and not hurt me at all, but I'd have to be pretty still.  If I was moving at all, my chances of escaping without injury go way down.  It's also possible that in this case, thrown into the path of an SUV means making contact with the front bumper or grille.

38
General Banter / Re: Helmet Laws
« on: June 08, 2012, 03:17:41 PM »
According to the MN Brain Injury Alliance (http://www.braininjurymn.org/org-pdf/public-policy/Who-Pays-ExecutiveSummary-Final.pdf), motorcycle-related traumatic brain injuries have cost MN taxpayers $40M in hospital charges over the last 10 years.

$40M over 10 years doesn't sound like much money for traumatic brain injuries.  That's around 75 cents per Minnesotan per year.  At that price, I wouldn't call it a problem.  And I sure can't imagine a government solution this cheap.

I make a personal choice to wear a helmet every time I ride.  Even so, the risk of all those motorcyclists who choose not to wear one are priced into my insurance premiums.  Beyond that, my tax dollars fund their care should they suffer a TBI as a result of their decision and can't afford their medical care.

I'm not legally required to carry medical insurance as part of my motorcycle policy.  I would guess that only those who do carry medical insurance on their motorcycle policy are subsidizing riders who don't wear helmets.  Doesn't seem like a problem to me.  If some insurance company wants to deny medical coverage to helmetless riders, or anyone who rides an R6, or riders who've never had training, fine.  If some insurance company wants to provide discounts to riders they deem safer than average,  no problem.  Otherwise, absent a mandate, I'm free to buy or not, based on cost vs. expected benefits.

My first choice to resolve this issue would be to allow the market to take care of it.  Individuals who don't wear a helmet should have to report their decision to their insurance company and carry the extra coverage needed to hedge the extra risk they are taking.

Forcing people to report their decision to their insurance company seems counter to your preference to allow the market to care of it.  Why not let insurance companies decide whether they will impose a surcharge for riding helmetless, or in flip-flops, or in a speedo?

My school carries liability insurance.  My insurers have rules about what my students must wear.  I operate under the assumption that if I ever file a claim, my insurer's going to want to know that the injured student was wearing the proper gear.  I don't see why this couldn't work with all motorcycle policies that cover medical expenses.  They sell me a policy based on my promise to wear gear that meets their standards.  If I get hurt and they can show that I wasn't wearing proper gear, then they don't have to pay.

Brent

39
General Banter / Re: Helmet Laws
« on: June 08, 2012, 12:49:44 PM »
What's going to stop the defiant riders from canceling the extra insurance upon obtaining the special license plate?

The same thing that keeps them from cancelling any insurance they have on their bike now.  That, and a hefty fine for not carrying the insurance that their plate says they carry.  Possibly the loss of the right to legally ride helmetless.

What about out of state riders?

If MN has a helmet law with some exemptions, then out of state riders will need to wear helmet until they can prove they're exempt.

In the real world, though, people under 18 and people on permits in Minnesota are required to wear helmets.  Some don't.  No law can create 100% compliance, but that doesn't make it a bad law.

40
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 07, 2012, 11:30:55 PM »
So the next question is.....is half of those shards laying in the road actually factory tires that somehow delaminated?

I don't know.  I guess most of us have just always assumed that every tire gator out there had to be from a retread.  Where's the evidence?  How do we know that new tires don't lose tread the same way and with the same frequency as retreads?  I'm guessing we don't.  It just seemed obvious, so we never questioned it.

41
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 07, 2012, 11:26:32 PM »
I feel very bad for the mother as she clearly tried to work hard at getting her daughter to wear gear.

However it bothers me that she seems to rationalize this as a simple, "If she only wore her helmet.....".  The updated police report made it clear the SUV struck her daughter and at speed, a helmet is probably not going to make a difference if there is massive trauma.

A helmet might have tilted the odds in her favor.

One of the more interesting ideas I learned from Motorcyclist's "Blowing the Lid Off" article a few years ago was the idea that the effect of multiple injuries can be greater than the sum the individual effects of the injuries.  A head injury is more likely to kill you when you have a bunch of other injuries than it would be without any other injuries.  Maybe I'm extrapolating too far when I say that you're more likely to survive other injuries when you don't already have a traumatic head injury, or maybe I'm not.

"The likelihood of dying from a head injury goes up dramatically if you have other major injuries as well. It also goes up with age. Which means that a nice, easy AIS 3 head injury, which might be perfectly survivable on its own, can be the injury that kills you if you already have other major injuries. Which, as it happens, you are very likely to have in a serious motorcycle crash." -Motorcyclist magazine, June 2005

42
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 07, 2012, 10:11:25 PM »
I have a hard time believing under-inflated retreads are no worse for falling apart than a factory tire under real world application.


I don't have any good reason to believe retreads fall apart any more often than conventional tires when run underinflated.

"The worn tread is buffed away and a new tread bonded to the tire body in a process very similar to the manufacture of a new tire. There are different processing techniques, but the ultimate objective is always the same - affixing a new tread through the application of heat, time and pressure.

"All commercial airlines, as well as military jet aircraft, use retreaded tires. In fact, nearly 80 percent of all aircraft tires now in service in the United States are retreads. More than 100,000 aircraft retreads are used annually with an average of 270 takeoffs and landings per tread life."

Now, that is from TRIB, the Tire Retread and Repair Information Bureau (http://www.retread.org/?page=AboutRetreading), so I'm sure they're putting their best spin on it, but they do use heat to bond the tread to the carcass just as they do in new tire manufacturing.

"Following the inspection and buffing process tires undergoing the hot cure (mold cure) process are covered with uncured rubber and then cured in a mould similar to that used to manufacture new tires. In the cold cure (precure) process a pre-cured tread strip or tread ring is applied to the casing, which is then placed in a rubber envelope under a vacuum and cured in a large heating chamber or autoclave." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retread

43
General Banter / Re: Crashes Reported in the Media
« on: June 07, 2012, 06:17:44 PM »
This is only speculation on my part, but my guess would be that she tried to take evasive action (ie: hard braking, swerving) upon seeing the object in the road and that is likely what caused her to crash.  Had she had on protective gear (ie: helmet), the likely would have saved her life (until the SUV hit her)  Bad way to go out IMHO.  thoughts and prayers to family and friends of the victim.

I speculate that your speculation is true, Denyse.  It doesn't seem very likely to me that a piece of tread could cause a motorcycle to crash unless the bike was leaned over in a turn.  I suppose it could flip up and get jammed between the tire and fender, or something else, but your speculation seems more likely to me.  Really sad.

250 Ninja.  Kawi green.

Brent

44
General Banter / Re: Metal Valve Stems
« on: June 05, 2012, 11:44:00 PM »
I don't disagree with anything there, but it's not "safe" (which nobody has claimed, safer, yes, safe, no) and it's not as controlled as many believe / would have everyone believe;

On the track, we just eliminate a bunch of things -- like oncoming traffic, intersections, wildlife (although I once had to brake hard for a deer in Turn 3 at BIR, and I once saw a turtle on the track at Grattan), pedestrians, really lousy drivers, cars and trucks, debris, guard rails, telephone poles, and long wait times for emergency personnel -- so that if we do crash, the risk of serious injury is less than it would be at the same speeds elsewhere.

your cracked valve stem "proves" that, in my humble opinion.  mid-corner intermediate / advanced and people'd have been affected, potentially very seriously.

I think you're saying that if someone had been riding close enough to me, I might have taken them down.  Is that right?  I had just passed some people at the end of the straight, and I don't know how close they were to me.  No one went down, though.  I would argue that my valve stem leak was probably the result of poor maintenance rather than high speeds, and that getting a flat in rush hour traffic would have been potentially much more dangerous. 

say, what is the primary benefit of switching to the style you picked?  i assume it's easier to use and less prone to failure?

I'm after the "less prone to failure," but the "easier to use" is a nice feature, too.

45
General Banter / Re: Metal Valve Stems
« on: June 05, 2012, 11:25:35 PM »
If I have it turned perpendicular to the rotors for easy access it hits the calipers as the wheel spins.

I hadn't thought of that.  Maybe the 25-degree one wouldn't hit the calipers.

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