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Messages - Ray916MN

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61
Late apexing is staying on the outside of a turn longer and turning in later than you would if you were taking the racing line (racing line minimizes the sharpness of a turn).



Late apexing makes sense on the street because:

  • it gives you a fuller view around a corner before you commit to a line, which gives more opportunity to select a line to avoid things that may be hidden around a corner
  • it provides a larger margin of safety if you go into a turn too fast and end up going wider at the turn exit than you planned
  • in a series of switchback turns, a really late apex (outside inside) correctly positions you to take the next turn in series
  • with a fuller view around a corner, it makes it easier to be on the gas while turning which provides more steering stability and cornering clearance

If you always try to late apex turns on the street, the signs are everywhere when you begin to run out of cornering reserve. If your plan is to late apex, you're running out of cornering reserve if
  • you can't avoid exiting near the center line as shown in the diagram or shoulder on left turns
  • you can't apply the gas while turning
  • you have to use the brakes or let off the gas to maintain your lane past the turn apex
  • you find it difficult to maintain or increase your pace going through a series of consistent switchbacks
  • you fail to exit a turn on the inside (away from the center line on right turns or the shoulder on left turns) with positive or at least neutral throttle

Ignore the signs at your own peril.

62
Over the years one of the things I've noticed is that many new riders have a tough time riding a motorcycle around a turn at speeds that they would consider moderate and have no problems with in a car. It strikes me that the notion that motorcycles should use the entire lane to turn quickly and/or that an outside inside outside (aka race line) line is needed to rapidly negotiate a turn might over complicate turns for new riders as well as enabling them to make up for poor steering skills by using all the lane width possible. New riders not only have to learn to steer, but also need to learn to select a line through a turn. I also realized that the same might be true for me too, that using an outside inside outside line might be masking some of my own poor steering. With preceding in mind, a stupid game I play when riding is to see how fast I can go while maintaining a foot off the center line, basically riding as if my bike were as wide as my entire lane, like a car. Doing this eliminates the need to select a line and giving a rider less to think about. Rather than the short sharp steering input and line selection associated with an outside inside outside line, riding like this is an exercise in steering precision and adjustment, forcing you to constantly adjust your line. The game is simple, see how fast you can go while maintaining a constant distance from the center line. You lose if your distance varies, you win the more precisely you maintain a constant distance and the faster you go.

Lastly, given that the safest line through a gravel strewn corner is often to ride a tire track, the speed at which you can go through a turn and maintain a constant distance from the center line is a pretty good approximation of how fast you can go through a corner and ride within a tire track.



When your cornering speeds get significantly higher than this speed you start to lose the ability to use the riding a tire track approach to dealing with gravel and implicitly lose some of your safety margin. When you are unsure of what lays around a corner taking a generic line allows you to peer around a corner until you see whether the turn and road conditions are appropriate for turning more sharply with a positive throttle to get a late apex line.

63
For Sale/Wanted to Buy / Re: Free Stands
« on: May 31, 2013, 12:40:46 PM »
Stands are gone. I'll delete this post in a couple of days.

64
For Sale/Wanted to Buy / Free Stands
« on: May 26, 2013, 11:48:38 AM »


Must take all 3

65
Introductions / Re: New to MN-MSTA, in St Paul
« on: May 24, 2013, 10:09:10 AM »
Welcome to the forum. Looking forward to seeing you out on a ride this season.

66
General Banter / Re: Heads-Up...2 MC Permits issued this week...
« on: May 23, 2013, 06:40:05 PM »
Congrats to your boys!

I'd also suggest the dirtbiketech http://www.dirtbiketech.com/ dirt bike school. Frankly in hindsight, I think it is better to take this course before you take the BRC.

67
Introductions / Re: Newbie here from Minneapolis
« on: May 15, 2013, 11:46:44 PM »
Welcome to the forum. Hope to see/meet you on a ride.

68
Introductions / Re: Do I do the AA Meeting introduction?
« on: May 03, 2013, 07:39:42 PM »
Welcome to the forum Ken.

69
Introductions / Re: Howdy from Brooklyn Park
« on: May 03, 2013, 07:39:04 PM »
Welcome to the forum. If you're bike was just cosmetically damaged, it should be pretty easy to repair. Looking forward to seeing the before and after pics to get a better idea of what you'd need to get it squared away.

70
For Sale/Wanted to Buy / Vetesnik 2011 Leftover Deals
« on: April 15, 2013, 10:01:02 PM »
Just got a flyer from Vetesnik Power Sports, MSTA TWiSTAR event supporting dealer in Richland Center, WI with some pretty incredible deals on 2011 leftovers.

2011 GSXR1000 - $9,999

2011 CBR600RR - $8,899

Call them 800-752-2556 or visit their website at www.vetesnik.com if you're interested.

71
General Banter / Re: Free Subscription to Motorcyclist
« on: April 13, 2013, 04:31:39 PM »
I hope it wasn't anything embarrassing.  ;D  That was so long ago, I can't remember what we talked about.

I thought it was a brilliant comment about how gear had become a little trendy, at least for the young sportbike crowd. I think the conversation started when I mentioned that I was surprised and happy to see so much actual motorcycle gear on the bikes I saw on the way to your place.

Holly molly, I just read the article. I figured when you wrote that you mentioned me in your column, I thought it would be something like "I was talking to my friend, Ray and he brought something up that made me think", not like something using my full name entirely attributed to me. I'm flattered.

72
General Banter / Re: Auto body painted parts
« on: April 13, 2013, 02:12:33 PM »
Any body shop will paint the covers with proper paint match codes. What is rarer is to get a body shop to paint to match the weather/sun fade of a car's paint or if your paint has pearl of metal in it, to get the same degree of pearl or metal flake in the paint. To do this takes skill, experience and a colorimeter. Most shops just paint the proper code and do not have a colorimeter to get the proper paint tinted to match and/or don't have the experience to get the pearl or metal to match.


73
Introductions / Re: New guy from Apple Valley
« on: April 13, 2013, 02:04:30 PM »
Welcome to the forum. Looking forward to meeting you on a ride or at a social event.

74
Bike Help / Re: RC 51
« on: April 13, 2013, 02:02:22 PM »
This thread is worthless without pics!

75
Introductions / Re: new guy at Plymouth MN
« on: April 03, 2013, 08:33:15 PM »
Welcome to the forum.

We certainly have group rides, but I think the vast majority of us are only cool in our dreams. Most of our rides are run a bit differently than other groups, so when you get a chance, please read this http://mn-msta.com/index.php/topic,6.0.html

Look forward to meeting you on a ride.

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